Yoshiharu Tsuge’s Influence on Two Individuals Bonded by Street Culture

– What was your impression of ZEN-LA-ROCK (hereafter referred to as Zenla), Shibata-san?

Shibata: I had seen him at clubs before, so I initially thought he was “someone who really loves to party.” However, when I had the chance to chat with him recently during work, I realized he has diverse interests, and his genuine passion for them shines through. It was somewhat different from my initial perception—more like he has a geeky side, you could say.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Exactly! It’s spot on (laughs). Terms like “geek” or “subculture” might be outdated now, but for someone like me who grew up in the ’90s, I might represent the last generation of geeks, existing in a niche.

– On the other hand, what was your impression of Shibata-san, Zenla?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I heard she’s into hip-hop. Then, on another occasion, I happened to sit next to Kabaya-kun and Eda-kun from “Bal” at a pub, and when I learned Shibata-san was their friend, I thought, “Ah, she’s definitely one of us!” (laughs).

So, both of you were connected through street culture, weren’t you? By the way, Shibata-san, do you usually read manga?

Shibata: Honestly, I don’t read manga at all… I’m sorry.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: No, no, that’s ok. On the contrary, I thought it might be more interesting, as individuals like you can approach the work without preconceptions. That’s why I invited you to participate in this interview. Just like with music and movies, it’s natural for everyone to start with no knowledge. I was the same way myself.

Shibata: Thank you. In that sense, I truly started from scratch. I borrowed the paperback edition and read “Neji-Shiki,” where I encountered the manga artist Yoshiharu Tsuge for the first time.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Most ordinary people probably don’t encounter Tsuge like you because his works tend to be quirky and niche. However, in my case, growing up in a family that ran a second-hand bookstore, I naturally came across artists like him from a young age.

Zenla-san, could you tell us more about the manga artist Yoshiharu Tsuge?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Well, back in the 1950s and 1960s, there was a culture of renting comics. Due to post-war scarcity, instead of buying manga books, people rented them from shops. That’s where the concept of rental-exclusive manga originated.

It’s akin to what we’d call digital manga distributed through manga apps nowadays.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: For younger generations, it’s like talking about the Stone Age. “Back in those days, money was made of big stones, you know?” (laughs)

Everyone: (laughs)

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Tsuge started his career with those rental comics, often focusing on themes like everyday life, dreams, and travel, emphasizing realism. However, since his last work was published in 1987, he hasn’t drawn a single page of manga for 36 years. In addition, he doesn’t appear in public often. Even when he won the Grand Prize at the Japan Cartoonists Association Awards in 2017, he canceled the award ceremony at the last minute.
Including these aspects, his personality is almost inseparable from the works he creates. That, I believe, is the charm of Yoshiharu Tsuge as an artist.

Insights into the Allure of “Neji-Shiki” Across Different Generations

– Even with his last work published in 1987, Yoshiharu Tsuge continues to garner high praise internationally, earning the moniker “Godard of the manga world” in France. Shibata-san, what were your impressions after reading “Neji-Shiki”?

Shibata: The blend of various illustration styles, from realistic to distorted, creates a sense of dissonance within the same setting and timeframe. Unexpected plot twists propel the story forward briskly, leaving you with a fresh and intriguing experience.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Quite an impression indeed!

Shibata: It was completely different from my expectations (laughs). I anticipated a story revolving around “screws”, given the title “Neji-Shiki,” but instead found screws to be merely incidental props, leading me to wonder, “What’s with the ‘Neji-Shiki’?” (laughs).

– The term “Neji-Shiki” isn’t mentioned in the story, is it?

Shibata: Precisely. This ambiguity aligns perfectly with the unique worldview of the narrative. After hearing Zenla-san’s explanation, “Neji-Shiki” finally clicked with me in relation to Tsuge-san.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: It’s all so bizarre, isn’t it?

Shibata: In a good way, it leaves you with a sense of unease, a restlessness.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I had my girlfriend read it too, and her reaction was, “I didn’t understand it at all, and it was kind of creepy.” I understood where she was coming from, but I couldn’t help feeling a bit miffed, like, “What? You didn’t get it?” (laughs) Because “Neji-Shiki” isn’t a work for everyone to grasp and appreciate.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: In today’s era, where all entertainment works, be it manga, dramas, movies, novels, are evaluated based on “how skillfully the foreshadowing elements were addressed,” it’s completely the opposite.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Yes, that’s correct. Even within the niche genre of cult manga, “Neji-Shiki” stands out as outstanding and unique. I can see why it resonates with creators. Personally, I can’t even recall when I first encountered it; it’s just ingrained within me.

– The world view is absurd and mysterious, isn’t it?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I mentioned that many works have themes related to dreams, but “Neji-Shiki” is exactly that. It has a slightly nightmarish feel to it.

Shibata: Personally, I found myself reading it while pondering if there were hidden meanings behind certain elements. For instance, I wondered if the ‘Kintaro candy’ held some significant symbolism. If I had encountered this manga in elementary or middle school…

ZEN-LA-ROCK: It could be quite traumatizing, couldn’t it?

Shibata: I find it a bit melancholic to delve too deeply into it rather than simply being traumatized (laughs).

– It’s like realizing you’ve become one of those adults who can’t view things straightforwardly, huh (laughs)? Could you both share your favorite scenes?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Certainly, the scene where the protagonist emerges from the sea is unforgettable. Also, the panel with the line, “Damn it, aren’t they all just eye doctors?” is another favorite.

– These scenes are often discussed online, aren’t they?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: As you’ll see if you read the materials I brought this time, actually, most of the panels have some original reference. Like two photos collaged together, for example. It’s kind of like “sampling” and “mixing” in hip-hop terms.

Shibata: That’s true! I felt a strong sense of déjà vu with some panels, and now that you mention it, I recall seeing them in a photo book by Ihei Kimura. I admire his work, so I was curious, thinking, “Wait, isn’t this…?”

ZEN-LA-ROCK: The use of this style is unique to “Neji-Shiki.” The fact that Tsuge created a 23-page piece using this method 55 years ago makes it even more fascinating. It’s incredible how a place like this, with eye doctors’ signs everywhere, actually exists, isn’t it?

Shibata: Does such a place really exist?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I’m not certain if it still exists, but it’s said to have been inspired by the work of a Taiwanese photographer. When you see it, it’s exactly like the scene depicted in the manga (laughs).

Interesting facts about ‘NEMES×POWERHOUSE presents 1968’.

– Finally, let’s discuss the main topic. How did the collaboration between Zenla’s “NEMES” and “Neji-Shiki” come about?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I have a friend who owns a printing factory that produces items for “NEMES” and merchandise for “FNCY.” This factory also produced T-shirts for the “Tsuge Yoshiharu Taizen (complete collection),” which was directed by POWERHOUSE. While sorting through my belongings during a move, I stumbled upon those T-shirts, sparking the idea. From there, I expressed my interest in contacting POWERHOUSE, and that was back in February of this year.

– It’s quite unusual for a collaboration with a manga work to go from inception to launch in about 10 months, isn’t it?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I think it was significant that Mr. Irie from POWERHOUSE knew about the collaboration between “NEMES” and another manga work called “Sanctuary” about three years ago. That played a big part, I suppose. Then came the struggle of how to incorporate “Neji-Shiki” into fashion. With it being 23 pages in total, it was easy to decide which panels to use, but we had quite a bit of trouble figuring out how to present them.

– The use of Chinza DOPENESS as a model also became a hot topic.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: For me, using Chin-san as a model felt like breaking some sort of taboo. I’m sure every brand would want to ask him, but it doesn’t seem like he’s into modeling that much. So, asking him because we’re close felt a bit different to me…

– Like cheating? How did you manage to make it happen from there?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Well, when I was pondering over what to do, the keyword “Chofu” came to mind. Tsuge-san’s house and Chin-san’s hometown are both in the Chofu area. It just clicked perfectly. Thanks to that, it went viral on social media, and it felt like I ended up relying on Chin-san again, haha.

– From the perspective of manga enthusiasts, I think collaborating with Tsuge’s works is a remarkable achievement.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Absolutely! I was like, “Is it really okay?” It’s like stepping into a sanctuary.

– It was also surprising how “Sanctuary” led to “Neji-Shiki”.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: There were indeed strong reactions. People said things like, “It’s a bit too out of the blue.” It’s not something you can casually incorporate, and I was prepared for sure that there would be a lot of criticism. But being criticized is also a sign of acknowledgment. However, so far, we haven’t received much negative feedback, so it’s more like, “Huh?” (laughs).

You have your own brand “Peep Inside Head,” but how do you feel about this collaboration collection?

Shibata: I read the manga, then saw the items, and I could really feel Zenla-san’s passion toward this collaboration. That’s why I believe both the world of ‘Neji-Shiki’ and the quality of the clothing were properly expressed.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Happy to hear that. Thanks! It might sound a bit cliché, but it really comes down to whether you have love and respect, right? In the past, it seems like there have been T-shirts, hoodies, and towels made around “Neji-Shiki”, and they weren’t bad or anything, but personally, I wanted to focus more on the silhouette and material, and even more on the price. Keeping the price increase as minimal as possible has been a theme for recent NEMES.

Shibata: This price for a sweater is quite reasonable, isn’t it?

Mohair Sweater ¥16,280
Shibata’s favorite is the mohair sweater that Zenla also owns. “When I put it on, I thought it was even better. It’s gentle to wear, surprisingly stylish and easy to incorporate, in a good way, beyond what you’d imagine from the content of the manga.”

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Right? Did you hear that? Bold text, please!

All: (Laughs).

– Is the pricing strategy considerate of customers who are not necessarily fashion enthusiasts?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: If anything, it’s because I personally don’t buy very expensive things. Even though this sweater would be fine at 25,000 yen or so, I’d be like, “Isn’t that wrong?” Or, “Are you trying to make money using Tsuge Yoshiharu?” That’s really lame, isn’t it? So, I pushed it to the limit.

– Every item is cool, isn’t it?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I especially put a lot of effort into the sweater, the patterned shirt, and the cap. Also, I like the pajamas. Please wear this and have dreams like “Neji-Shiki” everyone♪ Just kidding (laughs).

Cap ¥7,480
Embroidered with “1968,” the birth year of “Neji Shiki,” and the protagonist. It also features an 8-panel design commonly seen in vintage caps. “Normally, 6 panels are the mainstream, but at NEMES, this has been the standard for about three years now. Well, even if you ask, ‘Is there any difference?’ there isn’t one in particular,” says Zenla with a laugh.

– Earlier, you mentioned something about nightmarish…. Were these graphics created by scanning original drawings?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Using original drawings directly was not possible, so we created data from the PDF of “Yoshiharu Tsuge Taizen” and used it. Basically, while faithfully preserving Tsuge-sensei’s lines, we had to slightly modify them for the sweater, thickening the lines or adding details, as some expressions are difficult. It feels like tampering with the work of God! But while hesitating, I said, “I’m sorry, Sensei!” bowing my head towards Chofu (laughs).

Shibata: (Laughs). Personally, I think the cap is really cool. Caps have become a staple in women’s fashion now, and many people around me wear them, so even those who don’t know the original work might appreciate it.

– Shibata-san, if it were up to you, which part of the work would you pick to incorporate into clothing?

Shibata: I’d definitely want to use the scene with the eye doctor. Also, I quite like the part with the Kintaro candy. Hmm, but if I were to incorporate it into clothing as fashion, maybe the eye doctor.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Yeah, true. There are many scenes I’d like to use, but when trying to incorporate them into clothing, they all end up with a similar design… It’s difficult. Also, the boy riding the locomotive is quite famous. He wears a fox mask and a hood, and there’s even a character in Akira Toriyama’s “Dr. Slump” who pays homage to him.

Shibata: Oh, I see.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: His name is, of course, “Neji-shiki-kun” (laughs). It’s really interesting how he’s respected by various artists like that and has influenced many works.

– That’s also very hip-hop. Since none of the items are overpowering, it seems fun to mix and match them.

Shibata: Layering this sweater over a patterned shirt and deliberately showing just the collar seems like a good idea too, right? If someone wearing it sat next to you on the train, you’d probably end up reading it and cannot stop (laughs).

ZEN-LA-ROCK: (Laughs). Since only onomatopoeia remains and the character’s dialogue parts are erased, it might make people stare and wonder, “What’s this?” even more. Initially, I thought about using manga panels as they were, but it didn’t look cool enough. But then again, who knows if this is the right answer. Will it bring good luck or bad luck…?

Shibata: I thought it looked cleaner without the dialogue. And not deliberately matching the patterns on the pockets, body, and sleeves adds to the mysterious atmosphere of the work.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Really? Actually, not matching the patterns saved on costs, but it seems it turned out well (grins). However, for the back, I made it single-layered to avoid looking cluttered and gave the whole piece a slightly wider boxy silhouette. I wanted it to feel different from a regular shirt.

– It seems to be popular among young customers as well.

ZEN-LA-ROCK: Right! Even among young people who dig subculture, “Neji-Shiki” is recognized as a masterpiece. Plus, it might have clicked perfectly with the place like “TOKYO CULTUART by BEAMS,” and having Chin-san as the model, everything fell into place perfectly.

– How do you want to deliver this collaboration collection?

ZEN-LA-ROCK: I want to deliver this collaboration collection to those who truly love the works of Yoshiharu Tsuge and “Neji-Shiki.” I’d be happy if they also thought, “Fashion is pretty cool too.”
On the contrary, if someone who encounters the works of Tsuge for the first time through this and thinks like, “Wow, that was really interesting,” that would be the greatest reward for me. Another thing I gained from this is being able to brag to my parents. They said something like, “Proud of you, son!” So, really, thank you very much! (Laughs).